Should all immigrants to the UK be forced to learn English? Should they conform to the UK way of life? Many feel that a lot of immigrants try to set up their own little version of their original country in the UK. Is this right, should they be forced to integrate more?

Basically, I would agree that everyone who is coming to stay a long duration in UK be it for Marriage, work or pleasure should have the basic skills in Comminication in English. Specially if they are intending to take up employment in the UK.
As to forcing them to integrate, that is a definately a NO NO. You get English people all over the country who like to keep themselves to themselves so Integrating has to be left to peoples own choice. You will always find people from a different country forming a little community and there is nothing wrong with that as long as those people realise that they still have to follow the host country;'s rules and regulations, and this is where the problem always comes as they do not do that

Isn't that a bit like leaving one dictatorship and moving to another. As long as people respect the country they choose to live in then that should be enough.

I agree.

My opening post was more to see if it would get people talking.

Exactly what i think, if you choose to live in another country you should repsect their customs and traditions as well trying to hang on to those from your homeland. This is a tricky balance to make but one which is done properly allows people to integrate into a new society while presreving their own individual heritage at the same time.

Well half the fuckin yoof of today can't speak English and most dirty smelly foreigners/immigrants have a better grasp of the English Language anyway.

Those foreigners who can't speak the Mother tongue and choose not too.. well that's just ignorant and it won't get them anywhere, well apart from housing benefit, their tax paid, payouts, concessions, free legal aid, free health service, working tax credit, tax credit, more payouts, discrimination rights, free dental aid, clothing benefit, food vouchers to feed thirty seven people living in one house, government grants for housing improvements etc..

So how do you integrate if you can't be arsed to have a go at learning the language?

How do you integrate if you wear the full face mask?

When you immigrate to another country you can only keep your customs and traditions to a point, you can't go about changing what is the heart of a country,if you can't accept that then it's best you stay where you are because it's not fair to the natives to put the country in upheaval just because you can't adjust to it's way and didn't want to stay put. If I moved to say Pakistan I'd not expect them to change there customs and culture for me, and if I found that I couldn't live with them then I'd come back home. Things that bug me are we aren't allowed to wear hoods in malls and shopping centres, restaurants etc. which I agree with by the way, we can't carry knives yet we're expected to accept other cultures living here having their faces covered and carrying knives, what's that anyway, the law of the land is the law and should be the same for everyone.

Yes they should, learning english would save money for the councils form translater bills and reprinting of leaflets in other Languages, also i think immigrants should at least have to sit a test on english/british history to be aloud into the country.

English I may agree with you but History ?? I think you will find half the locals will fail that Test as well. :lolanimate:

I took my 'ickle one to Blackburn the other day on the bus, more of an adventure really coz either me or the missus drive her everywhere.. anywhere, whilst in Blackburn she looked a bit worried/frightened when all these full clothed 'undercover' ladies were walking down the street, so I put her mind at rest and said "Don't worry love, there walking post boxes and Postman Pat will round them all up!"

I certainly would. :lolanimate:

Surely this should include our home grown er, Rap generation.

Otherwise they'll always be unemployable.

A more interesting debate on immigration is why so many dozy fuckers still can't grasp there IS a problem with immigration.

With reference to today's news, a good title would be "So there IS an immigration problem! The Daily Mail didn't make it up after all!".


(I'd have done it but I'm not allowed to start threads on the big issues and no one else seems capable)

I see the police are starting to suspect that all the recent gun violence is being perpetrated by eastern europen "mafia" style gangs that are vying for supremecy in our cities. If immegration is allowing these kinds of people in then we are all fucked and the days wont be to far away when certain cities will be no go areas. I wonder what the politicians will do then when they need to go door to door?

England should decalre it's borders closed. We already have too many immigrants in the country and we should accept no more. All the ones already hear should be made to learn English and if they can not pass a basic English examination, they should be sent home. They should all also have to conform to the English way of life.

Ah, a fellow liberal I see.

Well, you've just failed on both counts.
Your English is a disgrace and you have no knowledge of history.
Fuck off out of the country.

Another fuckwit who has a slim grasp of English, but wants others to have to pass a test.
Your English is rubbish, my friend.
Fuck off out of the country if you can't use the language.

I get your point Musta. It reminds me of the Shilpa Shetty issue on Celeb Big Brother where one of the girls said that Shilpa couldn't even speak English properly. She speaks better English than most people I know. I'd love to have diction like hers.

I'd like to have dick action with her....LOL


Oops back to your room Nicholas!

Down, Fido, down.

Fuck off Shakespeare!!! I did not realise that posts to a footy forum were subject to English Standards proofing. I type quickly and have better things to do than pedantically proof read every post I make for the slightest spelling error or dropped comma. Obviously you have the time so please feel free to proof all my posts if that's what pulls your plonker m8.

As for the debate on Immigrants, I stand by my opinion that ALL IMMIGRANTS should be subject to basic standards testing to be allowed to live in this country and that we are already overpopulated with immigrants so the borders should be closed. As I am not an immigrant, and I have a right to reside in my own country, these tests do not apply to me and I will talk and type in any way that I like. If you have a problem with that, then it's tough shit.

Obviously, you are one of the countries bleeding heart "CIVIL RIGHTS" do-gooders that believes anyone who dares to say ANYTHING slightly against immigrants is a right wing Nazi War criminal who eats babies. Well, sorry to dissapoint you, but I neither go to Hitler youth marches or often attend cross burning meetings with my KKK friends. I strongly believe that immigration is vital to any countries infrastructure but the fact is that it has to be controlled and the other fact is that in this country, it is not.

Now, as this is a "DEBATE FORUM" intended for people to post their views so that the rights and wrongs of said views can be "DEBATED", maybe if you can musta a sensible opinion, you could post it.

Alternatively, if all you can come up with is the "ANYONE WHO DOES NOT TOW THE PC LINE IS A NAZI" speech, maybe you could take your head out of your arse and then take the time to FUCK OFF and post on a thread more your level. If you like, I will start a teletubby thread for you.

So much anger for one so young.

Thats where the argument falls down though. Why should the 'natives' not have to take the same tests? A recent survey found that something like 22% of British people didn't know that bacon & sausges originated from farms! Where the hell did they think it came from!?!? Why should these people be entitled to the country and more than a legal immigrant?

Birthright? In a country people that are born and live there are expected to live by the laws and rules of their own country. I don't think its too much to expect to have someone who wants to live in your country to at least be able to speak the language. Yourself and Musta don't seem to be allowing for the thick, ignorant or uneducated in the argument.

I'm not actually saying that immigrants shouldn't be taught English (this should be free and VOLUNTARY), I just find it funny that there are so many stupid British people that could do with the 'basic standards testing'. It's that same with the comment from Nudger about history. How can we expect immigrants to learn British history when there are far too many people here already that don't know much themselves. Ask the average person under 23/24 who Neville Chamberlain was and I doubt 50% would be able to tell you very much at all.

Hell, I think the whole world should just learn Esperanto and be done with it.

I'm not saying that immigrants should be forced to study English History to degree level or that they should not be allowed in the country unless they can recite the entire script of "To kill a mocking bird" from memory. All I am saying is that Immigrants into the UK (or any other country for that matter) should have to demonstrate a basic ability to speak the native tongue of that country and should also have to demonstrate a decent knowledge of that countries culture and laws. Who gives a shit if they do not know the difference between Neville Chamberlain and Garry Neville but you are basically saying that we should not have ANY controls on who comes to live in the country. I agree that there are already too many half witted English morons in this country so how would it help to allow a million half witted (non english speaking) immigrants flood over our borders.

Resources in this country are already stretched to breaking point. Maybe you will feel differently when your son or daughter has to attend a school outside of your catchment area because your local school is filled to the brim with the local Polish/Serb children. Or maybe it will take a 24 month wait for a vital operation because the NHS can not cope with the influx of new immigrant "Customers" who are using the service despite never having contributed to the running of it. Or maybe, when you are next out of work and find it impossible to get another job because all the work is farmed out to cheaper foreign workers, you may find yourself mumbling something you may not like.

As I said, I strongly believe that EVERY country needs immigrants and that the UK is better off for being such a multicultural society, but immigration needs to be controlled and it needs to be slowed down, if not stopped (at least for a while). There are currently 250,000 east european migrants entering this country every month. Do the maths!!!! That's 3 million potential new NHS customers EVERY YEAR. That's possibly about 1 million new school places needed EVERY YEAR. That's possibly anywhere between 1-2 million new people looking for jobs EVERY YEAR not to mention the strain on the benefits service supporting the ones who cant find work. Add to this the extra strain put on the already failing prison service catering for the criminal element of the migrants and the additional number of cars on the roads. AND THIS IS JUST THE EAST EUROPEANS......

I have found that the vast majority of immigrants do learn English, strangly enough because it will help them when it comes to getting jobs. You can't get mad at immigrants for taking lower wages; get mad at the companies that give them.

Also, where the hell did you pull that crazy stat about 3million Eastern Europeans a year? I think you have a warped view of immigrants and the number of them around.

I never said there shouldn't be any control over immigration either. There should be a great deal of it, and illegal immigrants should be dealt with appropriately. However, if you want the UK to pull out of the EU and stop immigration all together then you might not like what happens if it does. The country is losing power and pull on a World stage as it is, without the EU they would be even weaker.

I must admit, I am not 100% convinced by the numbers I qouted. I saw the figures in a tabloid and may have misread them so may be wrong on the numbers but this does not change a thing. The systems that i mentioned ARE already struggling to cope and an influx of migrants will only make it worse.

You yourself said that this country already has too many half witted young people in it. This can only be down to the failing education system. Please tell me how introducing more FOREIGN NON ENGLISH SPEAKING children into the schools and all the extra cost that are incurred with this (translators, specialist teachers etc) will help solve this problem.

Also, to blame companies for hiring cheaper imported staff is insane. Any company will try to cut costs in this way if it is there. The solution is to make sure it is not there.

Where would you draw the line Milgod? At what point DO we say enough is enough? As more and more countries join the EU, do we just keep accepting MORE and MORE immigrants until we can bearly move? At what point do we say that we just can not accept any more? Do you want us to wait until the country is on it's knees and all our vital services and facilities no longer operate? Do you want to wait until there are so many immigrants that the housing can not keep up and thousands are sleeping on the streets or in highrise slums thrown up as an emergency option. Or do we do something now and start to "Regulate" who comes into to country now and maybe prevent all this from happening.

The UK did opt out on the second last batch of new member states....Poles, Lithuanians etc needed work visas. Pity we didn't here, although Ireland opted out when Romania and Hungary were admitted. News item last night about an exit off the M50 where about 25 Romanys are living in tents under the road, yet they still reckon its better than Romania?????? Worst thing is, as I see it, the economies will become over reliant on cheap migratory workers, and when they go to better economies, the employers will be left high and dry.
Mind you, nice to see there is a Romany support group here. Big furore last week over a Nigerian woman and her two kids being deported - Her argument that one boy (an Italian citizen) would get better education for Autism, yet we have a High court case a month here trying to force the government to provide education for IRISH autistic children. Where do these people get money for solicitors and barristers?

Oh dear. This is starting to sound very nasty indeed.
Hyperbolic rhetoric in capital letters about FOREIGNERS swamping "us", the country on its knees, vital services no longer operating, highrise slums and people sleeping on the streets...
Where have we heard that before?

I dont know Musta...Where have you heard that beofre???

Judging by the fact that you obviously can't get past the "Everyone who says anything against Immigration is a Nazi" speech, I doubt it was anything you READ.

Would you like to post anything contributary to this debate? Or are you just going to stand there shouting "Racist, Racist, their all bloody Racists" for the rest of the debate?

He does have a valid point though that you can't seem to counter.

immigration is getting beyond a jike now and we need to say enough is enough.

i am all for letting in geunine asslyum seekers and imiigrants that come bring something to our country but we need to be more stringent.

if people come into the country illegally they should be shipped back out and told to go through the right channels (not swip accross the channel).

My parents are having housing problems at the moment and because they are English and managed to save a small amount they have no chance of being housed by the council.

I have told dad to adopt an Eastern European accent and say his surname is Ballanow instead of Bell and see if he gets any further.

Thats funny Milgod because I can't see any "point" in what he posts. What is his point? All I can see is someone who thinks that anyone who does not agree with mass immigration is a Hate filled Racist who hates all foriegners.

Point out to me what "point" you see in his posts and I will gladly attempt to counter it.

You seem to be over-stating things a tad and sound like the country is about to be destroyed. There are some problems that need to be addressed but you seem to have got in quite a frenzy over it.

How dare you speak ill of any one from outside our shimering shores.....

You are nothing but a HATE FILLED NAZI RACIST.

RACIST
RACIST
RACIST
RACIST
RACIST

:lolanimate:

I didn't say that the country is about to be destroyed, read my posts again please. I ASKED if YOU thought we should just continue to accept mass immigration UNTIL the country was on it's knees. I pointed out that there are several systems in England that are already stretched to breaking point (and this is true) and then ASKED what good would come of piling even more pressure on these systems by allowing mass immigration to continue.

Please feel free to point out where in any of my posts I have said that the "country is about to be destroyed".

I agree that I have got into a bit of a frenzy but this is due to being basically called a "Fukwit Racist" by someone who is obviously not willing to even hear any opinion that confilicts with his own.

I think musta used the phrase hyperbole. It doesn't even come close to some of the things you were saying. You have been implying that things are far more stretched than they really are. You still haven't stated where you got that ludicrous stat about 3million Eastern Europeans coming a year! There haven't even been that many TOTAL immigrants in the last three years (not even close by the way). Many immigrants also come over on 3month or yearlong worker schemes so don't even end up staying.

I have already said that there should be control on immigration, but things are not as bad as you are making out.