I'm so glad I found this site last winter when I started thinking about what fish to put in my new 1600 gal pond. I wanted small fish to prevent mosquitos, my wife thought it would be cool if they would school, and we both wanted them to be visible. When I found Robyn's Rosy Red minnow pages, it was like striking gold!

I started with just 12 of them, and didn't loose any during the three week quarantine period. Didn't see them at all for the first week they were in the pond, but then every once in a while they'd show up, often 'playing' in the current of the short stream under the waterfall. Once, one of them actually swam up the lowest fall (3-4 inches) and hung out in a little upper pool for a while. They seem to love fast moving water, and I really like watching them 'ride the rapids'.

In April they suddenly disappeared completely for three weeks (not even coming up for food). When they reappeared, so did zillions of little fry. Now the pond is teaming with them -- probably because I have too few adults to eat the fry before they get too big. I added three baby koi to the pond in May, but they don't seem to like eating minnow fry either. My only concern is that nature won't find its balance in our pond in time to keep the water quality from deteriorating and I'll have to do something drastic. One interesting thing is that the water has become super clear since the fry showed up -- I'm wondering if they are eating all the algae?

The males are adorable. They bravely chase the 'net monster' that invades the pond at cleaning time, butting their heads against it if it doesn't run off fast enough! What delightful little fish. I'm so glad I found this site. :)

I love rosy reds a lot. Your koi are still young, and there aren't that many so they probably haven't eaten any amount of baby minnows. Koi aren't big minnow eaters. I have four orfe in my pond over a foot long. They are more apt to eat some minnow fry. Goldfish will eat anything but if you add them, then you'll have a problem with too many goldfish instead of too many minnows. I've always just let my ponds find their own balance, never removing fish. With all the predators in and visiting my ponds, things have worked out fine. When I started to have too many goldfish, the heron took care of that so I netted the pond full time. My 1800 gallon pond with 30 some adult goldfish, 4 orfe, and 2 koi only has about a dozen maybe surviving adult fathead minnows. So, somebody is eating them. I keep rosy reds in my 153 gallon pond where they don't have to compete with other species of fish, and they're doing well there. Overcrowding hasn't been a problem (I counted 63 of them in late March when cleaning); perhaps I should thank the bullfrog who has taken over the pond from the green frogs.

The first batch of fry has grown up now, and they seem to want to school with the koi. As the koi swim around, a cloud of minnows follows behind. Really cute! I'm curious if it is normal for different types of fish to school together.

So far there is no evidence of predators, other than racoons which visit the pond but don't seem to have much luck getting at the fish, perhaps because the walls go straight down for almost 3 feet. They can't wade in.

So I think I will try to find some orfe to keep the minnows from over breeding. At the first fish store I went to, the salesperson hadn't even heard of orfe, so this may take a while!

Wow, 3 feet straight down! Yes, that will help keep predators out. I've seen my minnows chase (schooling) goldfish before but normally only smaller fish. I'm guessing your koi (that you're talking about anyway) aren't huge. I have only a few fathead minnows left in my 1800 gallon pond where the 4 orfe are. I'm guessing half a dozen adults is all. So, orfe (or at least something in my pond!) will certainly reduce their numbers. My 153 gallon pond doesn't have other kinds of fish and has about 60 adult rosy reds (mostly yearlings) and lots of wee ones. Most orfe that are sold are pretty small so it will take a few years for them to grow up and eat a lot.

After reading more about Orfe on this site, I'm having second thoughts. Since they like to school, it would be wrong to get just one. But if I get several, I fear there will be only a few minnows that survive, and I really do like having lots of minnows. Plus, I notice that there are very few fry visible anymore -- perhaps the first few batches that grew up are finally eating all the new eggs/fry?

Robyn, you are right that my Koi are small. I bought 2-3 inchers for $10 each. They sure do grow fast though. After three months the largest (we call him Zac "the vac" Hoover because of how he eats) seems to be over 6 inches. I'm thinking that the minnows follow the koi because the koi know when it is feeding time and where to be for first dibs. The koi-followers get second dibs. Are minnows that smart?

Today, Hoover and one of the larger minnows went after the same bit of food, and the minnow ended up getting flopped up onto a lily pad. It took the little guy a couple of seconds to flip-flop himself across the pad and back into the water on the other side! :lol:

My rosy reds follow my koi and goldfish around too. I only have 3 rosy reds but plan to get a dozen more. They are so cute. My neighbor had a breeding problem with his Rosy reds too. He got a channel catfish. The catfish controls algae and the population of rosy reds too. They get a little bigger than koi. I might get one if i have a problem too. Be careful of chemicals around the pond because catfish are very sensative to them!

"After reading more about Orfe on this site, I'm having second thoughts. Since they like to school, it would be wrong to get just one."

It would probably be unhappy alone.

"But if I get several, I fear there will be only a few minnows that survive, and I really do like having lots of minnows. Plus, I notice that there are very few fry visible anymore -- perhaps the first few batches that grew up are finally eating all the new eggs/fry?"

I have four large orfe and almost no minnows left in that pond. Of course, the orfe aren't the only possible culprits. The raccoons, herons, bullfrogs, and even animals like dragonfly larvae probably eat some. The more minnows that you have, the fewer percent will survive with each batch as the adult minnows not only eat each others eggs and fry but pester each other making it less condusive for a male to setup and maintain a nest.

"The koi-followers get second dibs. Are minnows that smart?"

I think they're just following the koi because it makes them feel safe to be in a school, and I bet the koi root up things revealing food for the minnows.

"Today, Hoover and one of the larger minnows went after the same bit of food, and the minnow ended up getting flopped up onto a lily pad. It took the little guy a couple of seconds to flip-flop himself across the pad and back into the water on the other side!"

When my rosy barbs eat in my 50 gallon tank, they flop up onto the frogbit and bounce around trying to find water again. It happens almost with every feeding.

Channel catfish will grow huge and not only eat minnows but small goldfish and koi as well. I think a month ago, some angler caught a 100 pound channel catfish or something; the thing was like 5 feet long.

i heard about that catfish. i think they are called pool catfish or something. They wont get that big in someones pond unless its HUGE.

Yesterday I went wading in my pond to do some cleanup, and discovered that those Rosy Reds are real nibblers! At first I thought that maybe, like cats, they like the salt on human skin (it was a hot day), but I doubt there was any salt left after wading for an hour, and they were still nibbling me. They tickle!! :blink:

My goldfish and minnows both have nibbled me in the pond. The goldfish like to sort of suck on my legs. Maybe they think the hairs are bugs on days I haven't yet shaved? It's kind of eery and slimy when one of my 1.5 foot koi rubs against me swimming by. They do it be accident and sort of thwack my leg to get away.

yes it is kind of ackward to be sucked on by a minnow.

Mabye they suck the dead skin flakes off your legs for nutrients?

no, they think that our hair is blood worms or something.

Well, being female, I shave, and the goldfish still suck on my legs while in the pond. I think this is mostly just curiousity on their part but they might get some salt out of it. They don't actually suck much of anything off of me. It's more like a taste test.

i guess you were right keith.

Why thank you! :P

kk, ;) .

I just got my last batch of rosy fatheads to put in the pond. This time I purchsed 150, theres safety in numbers! I put them in clean water and gave them fresh, clean food. A normal fathead accidently jumped out of the tank onto the hot pavement, but I quickly rescued it. It turns out this minnow had an important purpose. Anyway I let them go and to my surprise, none went into shock like last time, these were much healthier! I poured them in and they quickly formed this huge ball of minnows, this is great now those big fish wont have a chance to get them, especially since they were in the shallow water surrounded by plants,algae,and rocks. After a few minutes they started to move a little, I guess to explore. Suddenly 3 groups of five minnows went in three directions, left,right, and foward, I guess they were the fish "scouts." Once I realized none of the fish got eaten, even though trout and pike were in the water, the large group started to forage for food. One even leaped out of the water and ate a water strider! Then that one that previously fell on the hot pavement started to have a purpose. It was on the outside of the "fish ball". Everytime a minnow would try to escape the ball it would round it up, like a cattle dog, smart fish! Then a group of sunfish and small bass moved in, now im talking 8-10 of them at once, I thought I would see a massacre! But the group all moved as one and scared the fish away, i've never seen that before, it reminded me of Finding Nemo, but freshwater! :P Now in the future I hope to see plenty of minnows, but hopefully the will turn to a natural color and blend in with the neighbors. B)

good luck with this batch!

Sounds interesting. Your big fish will eventually eat some of the minnows I'm sure. I expect that their tight schooling ball will not last as they explore and age. Mostly young minnows school. Since you have both rosy reds and fathead minnows, when they start reproducing, over a few generations, by natural selection and with your predators, you will gradually have fewer rosy reds and more fatheads.

they wont get eaten, if the fish are well fed its fine.