Yeah, I was just wondering does anybody here believe in Jesus, or God. If so or if you dont please post why you have the beliefs you do. I personally believe in God b/c of the amount of scientfical and historical evidences we have. I'm not here to convert anyone into a christian but if you want to know more im here.

I don't have a religion. I dont think someone/something made everything in the universe. I think we all evolved from apes/monkeys besides theres more scientifical evidence of that.

I tend to disagree with the evolution theory simply b/c of the study leewenhook performed .... also something can not come from nothing. Take for example your room if you left it alone for years and years would some new thing be created also what first started evolution what came first and how. I dont know that my perspective on evolution I have studied many "proofs" of the creation of the earth and have easliy disaproved most but have not been able to do so with christianity.

evolution takes 100s of years not just a few. during 1700's if someone was 6' you were a giant now alot of people are people evolved and grew to fit thier habitat better

Hmm.. but still your height is determined by the size of your parents and what genes you have recieved not by the "evolution theory" funny we see know signs of evolution today for ex. we have discovered animals ex. turtles that live for hundreds of years now according to you it takes yrs to evolve why no signs of turtles evolving. Why do we humans not evolve into something b4 we die we all have an expiration date no living thing can live for over 200 yrs and evolve into something else if so for ex. nothing could ever become extinct b/c something else would evolve into it right? again this is just my opinion right or wrong these are my thoughts.

Ima tell u right here, im no monkey!

bad subject to bring onto these boards. all i can say is, you asked for it.

it all counts what on the priority list... i dont think getting taller is that high up... plus each race/class of people have their own nichs. Here are some quick steps in evolution that i can think of... off the top of my head... here they come... ok!

The Black Plague. people were soon born immune to this plague so the species would be able to go on.

Brain Power! Everyone is getting smarter... well most... ok just some...

Industry.

the human body. just watch the summer games. you can watch the impossible records be broken by teens.

those are just a couple.

and i will ask a question to all the bible thumpers out there. why does the bible have an author?

woo someone agrees with me i feel so loved Hugs!!***** :wub: Hugs!!***** :wub:

People belive what they do it is stupid to comment on sonmeones beliefs if they are not hurting someone or something, I mean the concept of god has been around since mesopatamia, long before the bible or the tora, the concept of a higher being stems from not knowing.

Wether or not it is true, while in my mind is nothing we should worry about, it matters not wheter we do good to follow a religion or do good because we wanna be good people ultimetly we should just be good people wether it be because we belive in god or not.

You see the bible was written to show people a proper path to walk down not something that should be taken completely serious, the bible itself was translated so many times through so many languages that most of the origanal text has probebly been altered.

evolution can be seen in slight forms already. look at how virus's can evolve to avoid the immune system. as well its being said that some people who were born recently are being born without wisdom teeth as most have them pulled (not 100% about this)

i see this as an oportunity to debate this contraversial topic. Besides if no one talked, commented or asked questions about this, or any other subject, what would any of us know? in my opinion having an open mind will get you farther in life. if you hopelessly divulged into any religious system (or any system at that) you cut off your own path to true enlightenment.

However one of the things about having an open mind is seeign as much as you can so wouldnt it be in ones best interest to at least look into the existence of a higher power even if the person does not belive in it per say, if you want to have an open mind it should not be half assed, instead it should be full learn as much as you can, yes this is a contraversal topic that is worth discusion however it should be discusse dbetween idviduals that are able to form a solid oppinion and have an open mind.

get off your highchair, fool.

and please share with me how i am close minded and uneducated.

Funny I do not remmeber insinuating tht it was you, or out right saying it

Fool, such a negative comment made on such a contraversial topic that should be debtaed seriously, I think that more then proves my point.

you still havent informed me of how i am close minded or ignorant.

The idea of a 'god' was well before Mesopotamia. Shamanism has been around for tens of thousands of years. The age of Mesopotamia wasnt until 6-7,000 years ago. (correct me if im wrong.. not sure on the years.)

Commenting on something GEN said earlier somehting like the bible has been rewritten so many times in so many languages it has probaly been altered. Many believe this b/c it seems logical withought investigating how the bible was orignally written. First off there were people called scribes which were called out to rewrite God's word to make copies etc. The scribes would write the Bible letter by letter if 3 mistakes were made their entire work would be thrown out. The scribes also comapared their writings to other scribes to see if they had exactly the same passage word for word. They also took the name of Jesus seriously so before writting the word God they would wash their hands.

thats really cool. im glad i know that now ((being 100% serious, no sarcasm))

ok i was thinking and talking about this the other day. And i was thinking... what if Jesus was a man and all that stuff, but not attached to a "god" in any way. What if Jesus was crazy. Not funny crazy, but smart crazy. maybe not crazy, but manipulative. So smart so manipulative that he was able to get people to follow him, feed him, protect him, etc. And all along the way he was creating a religion that would alter the world and be followed for thousands of years. *shrugs* just a thought...

see that is the thing I did not call you close minded I said people were you took it as an insult and an opprutunity to attack me and call me a fool, which was th point I was trying to prove that you as we stand are not mature enough to debate this.

ok then, in the post that followed mine it sounded like you were going after me. *Shrugs* and i dont really mind if you think im mature enough or not, im still going to give input. This topic is to intriguing to stop. ^_^

Commenting on what fairy said about Jesus in a earlier post. Well if i remember right you had said somehting about how if Jesus was a man so smart so manipulative he could start his own religion and get people to follow him. Well many unbelievers believe this as well they also believe that Jesus could only be three things a liar, a lunatic, or Lord. First off Jesus has proved himself to many people in the past that he was God ultimately by perfoming miracles. Well some of you may be thinking well couldnt he have been almost llike a magician and people would be so amazed at his work well the things Jesus performed were no parlor tricks i mean he could truly heal peopleand make them be able to walk or the blind to see so ya but remember this is just my knowlegde.

those people he healed could have been actors/friends or whatever. he could have talked to previously before doing the miracle. thats just an idea though *Shrugs*

I'm not even going to read all these, all i know i was made by God and his son jesus opened the gates. No i didn't come from a monkey or watever nonsence these sci. say.

you forget that that was some 2000 years ago. what we hear now may be an evolution of what he actually did. he may have helped to move a paralysed from one place to another, and as time wore on the story evolved and changed to him making him capable of walking on his own. as to the bible being changed you should probably remember that not all of its copiers would be as dilligent as the scribes and monks who originally wrote the bible. a lot can change even if its only one word at a time over 2000 years

Man I'm really diapponted in the amount of replies I would really like to hear more people's opinions!

^^ Yay! A God believer! *hugs* I am too! I'm a Pentacostal Christian and I strongly believe in Jesus ^_^ Who said you can't be a Christian and listen to punk rock? That's just wrong to say and I strongly disagree! At first look at me, I ALWAYS wear black and not smiling but you can't judge me by that! You gotta get to know me! ^^ Yeah, I'm big on the Jesus thing^^ It's nice to know someone else does too! I only know one or two people in my school who actually does and admits it! ^^=

-Schreient Assassin

Also, are you guys forgetting the early skeletal remains of humans? Skeletal remains have been found of them which proves as a fact we evolved from a less compentant species. Here's the name of each 'species' of man. All of which skeletal remains have been found of-
Ardipithicus ramidus
Australopithecus anamensis
Australopithecus afarensis
Australopithecus africanus
Australopithecus robustus
Homo habilis
Homo erectus
Homo sapiens archaic
Homo sapiens neandertalensis
Homo sapiens sapiens(us)

Okay this is pretty heavy for a general discussion board. I really think everyone is entitled to their own opinion, and although I am Wiccan I think there are many paths to the Almighty.
But of course I have to put my two cents in. I am not an evolutionary theorist, but I am a senior in my major (anthropology) and I have had to take MANY courses on primatology and evolution, and I encourage many of you to read up on it more, because there are some GROSS misconceptions on this post. I love the analogy about if you leave your room alone nothing will happen. First of all evolution takes millenia and actually things would "happen". Just because a new form of life wouldn't be created doesn't discount evolutionary thought, what about mold, microbes and germs? Afterall that is how evolution started with tiny micro organisms, not with apes. And it is true that thousands of year ago people were generally smaller in stature, thats a product of many influcences including nutrition and gene flow. Its not like every gene that humans now possess in their DNA has always been the same and available forever.
Wow I need to chill, this is such a hot button topic. But keep an open mind everyone and never assume that you know everything about anything, because nobody does.

I would just like to add that 'Christ' was not Jesus's last name for those of you who didnt' know that.

You can discuss this topic, as long as it doesn't get out of control

i think that jesus may have existed at one point, but was simply an ordinary guy who liked to help people, and people formed a religion around him. personally i believe there is an almighty, but i don't believe he created us, i believe he gave life (very, very simple life), and that it evolved to what it is today

Jesus was in fact a real person. Whether you accept him as your savior is your own choice. It took Ed a while, but after meeting his best friend Ed began trying to follow Jesus' teachings. Even if you don't believe, what he taught is good stuff for one to try to follow. Ed is not trying to start a flame war, but it seems like people have a million and one reasons to deny who Jesus was/is, but has anyone that has these thoughts ever taken the of time to just sit and think good stuff about Jesus?

Ed won't lie, Ed stopped going to church and turned Ed's back to the Lord for almost 10 years. Ed forgot a lot, but this past year Ed turned around and began to listen again. While Ed is still learning, Ed has never been happier. Ed's just saying what Ed feels and what Ed knows.

This is mosxtly in response to the above post. For years I used to be a Christian, and I don't mean the kind that goes to church on just Christmas. I even went on a mission trip to Mexico to minister and build houses. So for your questions does anybody who doesn't believe in Jesus ever stop and try and think "nice things" about him, the answer for me if that I have. However since I was 15 I have decided to be Wiccan, and its not because I don't like Christians or I hate Jesus or something ridiculous like that , I just decided that although there are a lot of wonderful people who are Christians, and that that Christianity it basically a good religion, I decided it wasn't the best fit for me. I think a lot of Christians assume that people who don't believe that Jesus was the Messiah are negative. It certainly seems that the above poster is under this assumption. I just wanted to point out just because you aren't Chrisitian and or don't believe in Jesus doens't mean all you do is go around all day thinking bad things about Jesus and being a generally negative person.

Ed caught you assuming! Ed was talking about how the people were calling Jesus a lunatic and other stuff. Ed does not care what religion people are because if they are a different religion then that's what they believe. Ed has lots of friends of many different religions and likes them all equally and doesn't think down upon them. Ed was going after those saying that he didn't exist or calling Jesus a fraud. Please do not ASSUME that all christians assume that just because someone doesn't believe in Jesus that they are a bad person. Ed never once said that and please don't put words in Ed's mouth. -_-

Sorry Ed if I thought you were saying something that you actually weren't saying. Its good to know that you respect other people's beliefs, we need more people like that in the world.

hmmm I think Jesus existed, I just don't believe god made everyone and everything in the world...

I change my earlier post(the first one in this topic) I'm now converting well not really converting since I was atheist but now I'm a shin buddhist. I like the idea of accepting that pain will come to you no matter what and you must accept it. The sad thing is I can't blow up any more birds since I must respect all life. I'm happy with any religion which supports happiness and not a god.

I believe Jesus Christ was really an existing person. But I do not believe IN him. I'm religionless. And I don't like to consider myself "Atheist", or "Pagan". But I DO respect others faith, beliefs and opinions. D: I have no exact reason why I do not believe in there being a God, but I do wish I were Jewish. That'd rock.

Jesus was a real peron, as in there was a man named Jesus born, his birthday was sometime during the summer not during December, he never travled more then 50 or so miles away from his home town (from the best we can tell) and odds are he was not a messiah, but more or less a person whom many people belived, put there trust in and followed, liked his ideas )probebly alot like an old presidential candidate)

Whether he was the son of god, or if god exist in my oppinion, are irrlevent, when compared to the messege that religion lays down to many people.

NGC.. all your posts in this thread are well said!! Personally I dont believe in god or the devil. For to many reasons to explain. But that does not mean I dont believe in jesus being an actual person and that he had very interesting and profound teachings(that are now transformed into whatever people want to believe, and not his original meaning). As for evolution vrs god , I think my opinion is already obvious. Ignorance is bliss, and thats how it should stay for those who have already taken to finding the need for the support of some higher being in this world(because obviously religous people are happy with there beliefs). Not to offend anyone but, you know.. a long time ago religions were used to justify a legitament nature for selling cheap goods at beyond high prices("In the name of God!!"). It just shows how human nature, through generations, can degenerate a truth.

I am a Shinto Agnostic(sounds weird eh)
I believe that the Bible has about just as much truth to it as any religion..which is little to none. I still don't mind the religion, and if in fact it were the true one, I would be accepting, however I greatley dislike "Christian morallity" of today, and everything that has to do with Christianity. The only Christian religion I will accept is The way it was on the old days**hence my smeXXXy icon**