I was playing against WE's and my bray Shaman was in a unit in combat with some dryads, he had the staff of Darkoth which counts as a Braystaff. Does this count as a magical attack that would negate his ward save or not?

I don't think so, I thought it counts as a bray staff with the exception that it gives you the extra spell, but the weapon itself counts as a bray-staff...

I am inclined to say yes... Although it doesn't prohibit you from taking another magical weapon (it's not under that catagory), the fact that it counts as a bray-staff (a weapon) and is magical makes a very good arguement for it working as a magical weapon.

However, I do not have any true support for my stance, but I will definatly add this to my list of crazy mistakes in the beast book...

To counter Redsquids arguement, items that count as Great Weapons would then also not count as magical weapons... things like the slaughterer's blade, which counts as a great weapon and has no additional effect on the person wounded by it.

Well, the slaughterer's blade is of course in the magical weapons section, unlike the staff of darkoth...

I would say its attacks counts as magical, since it's a magic item that you can use as a weapon, same as the warrior familiar, wich I also think should count as makin magical damage.

You just have to decide it with your opponent. There has been the same topic on few other forums and noone has the answer.

http://warhammer.org.uk/PhP/viewtopic.php?...ghlight=darkoth
http://warhammer.org.uk/PhP/viewtopic.php?...ghlight=darkoth
http://warhammer.org.uk/PhP/viewtopic.php?...ghlight=darkoth

Yeah what Bladesinger said on the 3rd link:

But it seems a lot of people have different opinions and nobody's certain...

I thought it might be worth resurrecting an old thread to point anyone who doesn't know to Here where the man himself has spoken.

Saw that this morning myself. Looks like its settled - the attacks count as magical

I checked out that other forum, maybe this is off topic, but, someone mentioned giving a Wargor of Tzeentch the staff. When I read the BoC army book it only mentions Bray Shamen as being able to take it (without excluding others). Whats the scoop?

The other question is if the staff is a 2 hd weapon or not. Cant find it in the BoC book, and there is precident for other strength increasing weapons to be one handed (Black Maul).

Beast Fox

Tzeentch marked BoC characters are defined as shamans in the magic section. Hence, they can take the staff of darkoth. The restriction on it is just wierd, they could of said it could only be taken by BoC characters and cleared up the whole thing, but they didn't.

It's definitely two handed when used offensively as it says 'may be used as a great weapon.'

It's not so clear if it requires two hands when used defensively (+2 Armour save 'but does not give any additional benefit') but I think you'd be pushing your luck if you tried to argue you could use it one handed - it's a staff, which (in reality) is a two handed weapon.

are you asking that if you use it defensively can you use a sheild with it? or are you asking that if you use it defensively can you use a different hand wepon with it,

well if you use a sheild with the staff, i beleive you cant attack back, beacause you cant attack with the sheild hand, and youre using the staff defensively, so what you going to attack with.

though if you dont have a sheild you can still attack, as it doesnt say it takes two hands too used when used defensively.

-warmaster

As far as I know you still get your attacks back. The only item in the game that makes it so the user cannot attack is the cautious sheild, and that specifically says the bearer may opt not to attack to recieve a greater benefit.

I think you can strike as well.... just says gives a bonus to armor save, not that you can't attack.

Since it's more like a shield when used defensivly, can it be used during Bears Anger (like a shield(non revised lores)), because a 5str 5t 5A Bray shaman with 2+ save would be kinda imbalanced ;P

doesn't the bears anger spell wording say may not use a weapon? The braystaff (whether used defensively or not) is still a weapon so you wouldn't be able to use it.

Nethrag is correct, Bear's Anger says he may not use a weapon, and the title of the box on page 19 of BoC book is "Beastmen Weapon: Braystaff," so it's still a weapon however it's used.

:blink: That staff is so confusing! I never take it to battle. We need a veteran to give a paragraph on the staff and pin it, 'How to use it' so no more threads like this will ever be posted ever again! :blink:

it's completely sorted now except for an official ruling on whether it uses 2 hands when used defensively.

It does count as a magic weapon (from Gav)
A wargor of tzeentch can use it
It definitely uses two hands in offence
You cannot use it with the bears anger spell
You can still attack while using it defensively.

The only thing up in the air is whether it only takes up one hand defensively and you can therefore use a shield aswell. According to common sense it'd still use two hands, according to the rules as written it only uses one.

Although I have to say that some peoples fluff argument that "it's a staff and therefore should automatically take up two hands" doesn't ride with me - I seem to remember gandalf using his staff pretty effectively with one hand in the films (even dual wielding with a sword!), so if an actor can do it I'm sure a bray shaman who's been using it most of their life can.

I think it dosen't count as a magic weapon. Why you might ask. Well there's three reasons. The first one being its in the arcane section of the beastman army book! Secondly, all it is is a braystaff that gives you an extra spell. The Braystaff itself does not confer any magical beniits when attacking with it. Thirdly, You can take it and another magic weapon, and as we all know you can't take two magic weapons.

Staff of darktooth is a magic weapon, I just dont like feeling like digging up the thread right now though.

This is on page one of this same thread. No more discussion about its status as a magic weapon is necessary.

I think the idea of a pinned threat covering the dos and don'ts of the Staff of Darkoth is actually a good one, so perhaps one of the mods could arrange for that...